Spindle Gouges

[Kirk Amidon]

Having some difficulty with some of my spindle gouges. First, what do I have? I have a sorby fingernail spindle gouge with a fingernail grind. This is one made from round stock. I also have a few of what I believe are called Continental spindle gouges, ranging from 3/8" up to 3/4". These are the ones made from flat stock and are more like my roughing gouge.

I'm struggling terrifically with catches using the Continental gouges. They are working fine when the work is flat - parallel to the bed/toolrest, but when I try to cut a hollow or a cove, I'm getting catches.

It does not seem like I get the same catches with the round bar sorby gouge. My guess is that the cutting point with the Continental gouge is not close enough to the fulcrum. Cutting downhill, into a cove and getting catches. The gouge twists as it catches. Is the technique effectively different for these two styles?

Any pointers on how the Continental gouges should be sharpened? How much of a radius at the tip? All of mine have tips which are straighter across than the Sorby. My 3/4" gouge has a radius about nickel sized. My smaller ones are straighter.

 

[robo hippy]

Well, I am not sure which spindle type of gouge you are talking about here. The spindle roughing gouges, both standard and continental are sharpened straight across the face, and with a slight arc. I am guessing you are talking more about the spindle detail gouges, which to me look more like swept back type bowl gouges, but tend to have more of a pointed nose rather than a rounded one, but there are probably many variations. I have mine ground to about 35 degrees on the bevel, and maybe swept back about 1 1/2 times the width of the gouge. They are great for turning beads and coves, but not made for any type of roughing. If I am turning a bead, I tend to lead with the nose, similar to what I do with a skew, and yes, I do use them some times... On coves, I tend to lead more with the wing rather than with the nose. Not sure if this helps or not... Trying to figure out how it would roll when you catch. That, to me, means you are catching the wing, and that would mean no bevel support.

Not sure about the round bar one. Sorby used to have a 'skewchigouge' which was round bar stock, and you grind away about half of the top side. They can be pointed, or slightly more rounded. Don't think they were very popular.

robo hippy

 

[Kirk Amidon]

Yeah, I thought I should have included pictures.

Here is a representative sample of three: A Benjamins best 3/4" Continental and an "antique" Continental half inch, along with the Sorby round one.



Both the BB and antique are not round stock. I'd characterize them as being much wider and flatter than the Sorby, leading me to wing catches as you point out.

 

[hockenbery]

Any pointers on how the Continental gouges should be sharpened? How much of a radius at the tip? All of mine have tips which are straighter across than the Sorby. My 3/4" gouge has a radius about nickel sized. My smaller ones are straighter.

first, IMHO the continental gouges are squirely compared to the round bar gouges.
They are sort of like round nose skews.

i grind mine with a little more wing and a 30 degree bevel.

I think success in using requires riding the bevel, letting tool cut, and holding it gently.

a tight grip and forcing that tool into the cut will cause it to come off the bevel which create a catch or a backward spiral when the tool kicks out.
When a round bar spindle gouge comes off the bevel it often goes into scraping mode rather than catch mode.

Continental gouges are great tools but they are demanding on riding the bevel.

 

[Doug Freeman]

I put a longer grind on mine, a bit more like your round bar gouge, 35 deg. Think about the tool width and the width of the cove you are making. You may be trying to make too narrow of a cove, and as you roll it your are getting the trailing edge/wing in contact.

 

[Dean Center]

If 'the gouge twists as it catches" that would suggest you are applying the edge to the wood without good support under the edge. I wonder if the Continental gouges, like skews, require you to use only the bottom 1/4 or so of the edge. There is probably a good reason why they have been mostly abandoned in favor of the round/fingernail grind gouges and maybe you've found it. Perhaps set them aside for now and try again when you are confident in your tool control and ability to cut with bevel contact.

 

[Kirk Amidon]

Thanks, I'll take all of this in consideration, and will try to grind a longer edge, and try with the lighter touch etc. The description of it being a rounded skew is spot on, especially with the widest ones. I'll treat it accordingly. (and then buy a 1/2 round spindle gouge)

 

[Mike Johnson]

As a person gains more time turning with each type of tool you will retain a "muscle memory" and a mental visual image of the geometry of the cutting tool meeting the surface and slope of the piece being turned. When the geometry of the work surface changes you need to adjust the geometry of the tool presentation to the piece being turned, this can be a challenge starting out but everyone gains that instinctive skill set over time. You also have the rotational angle of the gouge to consider in the geometry equation of the cutting tool meeting the piece being turned, if you rotate the gouge too far you expose the "wings" to catch the work piece. Each time you get a catch try to mentally envision what angle the tool was at and how far the gouge cutting edge was open to the surface of the work piece, if you can identify the error in each tool catch you can correct your technique and over time eliminate the tool catches.

 

[robo hippy]

The Sorby gouge is fairly typical of spindled detail gouges. Mine are a bit more pointed, but that basic grind is good. If you want to see a really pointy one, look up the 'vortex' tool. One that Stuart Batty and Cindy Drozda use. Half round bar stock and kind of a needle nose. They are variations of a tool I first saw Allen Batty use. I talk about it a bit in the video I did about Doug Thompson's fluteless gouges, which is a tool I like.

I do like the continental style SRGs. I have one about 1 1/2 inches wide, and some times I prefer it to a standard SRG.

robo hippy